Ep. 264: How Aaron Dessner Became an Industry Favorite and the 3AM Text That Became 'folklore'

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Today's guest is a musician's musician who co-founded The National, the Grammy-winning band behind Boxer, High Violet and Sleep Well Beast.He co-wrote and produced Taylor Swift's folklore and evermore, including cardigan and willow. folklore won Album of the Year at the Grammys.He worked on The Tortured Poets Department and produced Ed Sheeran's Subtract.He's behind Gracie Abrams' I Love You, I'm Sorry and Noah Kahan's Porch Light.In the last year alone, he's made records with Mumford & Sons, Florence + the Machine, Brandi Carlile, Sam Barber, Kevin Morby and Suki Waterhouse.He's one half of Big Red Machine with Bon Iver's Justin Vernon.And he built Long Pond, the Hudson Valley studio where many of these songs were made.And The Writer Is... Aaron Dessner!Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.Follow us on socials: @andthewriterisA special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.Amazon Music for Songwriters. Your support means the world to us.And SONA — Songwriters of North America. If you write songs, join them. They fight for us.0:00 Intro1:00 Cardigan, willow, Porch Light — and eight albums in a year5:26 Why "I Love You, I'm Sorry" was never the single7:27 Secretly rooting for the weird song8:17 When a pop star needs a single right now10:25 Don't fill the space: how he walks into a session12:12 Long Pond and "you never make a mistake investing in your creativity"17:24 Twin brothers and their dad's jazz drums22:48 "We faked it": how The National got signed26:48 Playing to no one — then 500 strangers in Michigan30:05 "Did you lose yourself?"33:14 When one bandmate starts writing hits for other people35:38 On stage with Taylor: "You're playing a stadium. It's okay."37:27 "Hey, it's Taylor": the text in 202040:34 The Dropbox folder — and cardigan by 3 a.m.47:45 The thank-you note that became willow51:49 Meeting Gracie Abrams — and 2–3 songs a day57:47 How an instrumentalist became the storyteller's whisperer1:01:11 Why h